E.107 Flight Frights and Mental Health: A Therapist's Perspective on Crisis Management

Ever sat in a plane, heart pounding as chaos unfolds around you? Imagine my surprise when a routine flight from LA to Boston morphed into a terrifying ordeal. Join me as I recount an incident involving a disturbed passenger and talk about the emotional turmoil it brought upon me. Despite the panic, it was remarkable to witness the courage of the brave souls on board who managed to keep the situation under control.

However, the incident left me contemplating. Do we do enough to address mental health crises during flight incidents? As a therapist, I've always championed authenticity, striving to maintain my genuineness in every interaction. I examine the concept of 'professionalism', questioning if it's always necessary. Perhaps, in some cases, it even poses a barrier to true human connection. This episode is a blend of my personal reflections and professional insights, inspired by Debbie Ford's book, 'The Dark Side of Light Chasers', a piece of work that has profoundly influenced both my personal and professional life.

You can get "The Dark Side Of Light Chasers" here.

Chapters

• 0:02 Flight Incident and Personal Reflections
• 12:23 United Airlines Incident and Emotional Impact
• 24:15 Preaching Authenticity and Being Real
• 29:22 Season Nine Premiere With New Guests

Transcript

Speaker 1: 0:02

Hi and welcome to Finding Your Way Through Therapy. The goal of this podcast is to demystify therapy, what can happen in therapy and the wide array of conversations you can have in and about therapy Through personal experiences. guests will talk about therapy, their experiences with it and how psychology and therapy are present in many places in their lives, with lots of authenticity and a touch of humor. here is your quick tip. Here's your host, steve Bisson.

Speaker 2: 0:33

Thank you and welcome to Episode 107. If you haven't listened to Episode 106, it was the most downloaded episode. Gordon Brewer was on. Please go listen. It was awesome. I can't wait to continue working with him.

Speaker 2: 0:45

But for Episode 107, i decided to link two episodes together, and the reason why is, as you know, in March we had an incident on a flight I was coming back from LA and I kind of recorded it, left it there And then I did a follow-up episode for Episode 96. And I was thinking, wow, it might be interesting to see how people can see the evolution. I'm going to actually do one next season just to see where I'm at around that too. But I decided to link both. So I hope you enjoy the result. Well, hi and welcome to a special episode of Finding Your Way Through Therapy. I am Steve Bisson. This was not planned. I hesitated actually to record this. I spoke to my therapist, told me that I had to wait a few days before, kind of, making my decision. So I don't regret it. And ultimately it came to a conclusion that I want to do it in one take. If it sucks, it sucks. If it doesn't, it doesn't, i don't really care. But I also want to be able to tell my story, be able to be vulnerable and just humanize therapists, because we're people and we go through stuff too. So the reason why I'm doing this it's about a week removed from the event.

Speaker 2: 1:59

For those of you who didn't hear, there was a flight from LA to Boston that had an incident on March 5, 2023. And I was on there with my girlfriend and my two kids. When I got on the flight, i had actually noticed him, just because he had very thick sunglasses on, And part of me was like I didn't feel comfortable And I know people are going to say that's hindsight, but ultimately I really did see that And I sat down. My two kids are sitting in the seat in front of me with a woman next to them. I'm sitting with my girlfriend behind them and there's a woman next to my girlfriend. I have the outside seat, so flight goes off without a hitch.

Speaker 2: 2:51

We end up being in flight for I don't know I can't remember how much time we were up there, but about 45 minutes left before the flight, i decided I'm going to go to the bathroom. The woman next to my girlfriend woke up and I said OK, i'll just go to the bathroom before we land. So I get up to go to the bathroom. He happened to be the gentleman right before me. I know that people might. I'm going to kind of like go with the narrative first before going into too much emotions. So go to the bathroom.

Speaker 2: 3:20

He was sticking around right after he got out and like wondering why. So I go to the bathroom. I step out of the bathroom, i see the flight attendant there's a door right in front of the bathroom And she's like someone played with the door And she noticed that. So I go sit down. I'm not, it's not my gig, right? I'm not going to get involved And my kids decide they need to go to the bathroom before we land, just like I did. So they go in the back bathroom.

Speaker 2: 3:45

While they're in the bathroom, the flight attendant one of the great flight attendants we had goes and asks if he played with the door, and just about the same tone. I'm kind of like not exactly sure about the tone, but it was an accusatory tone, it's just something like a matter of fact done by the flight attendant. Well, that got him upset. He started getting angry and he started stating different things, one of them being that he's Baltazar and started saying that women and kids are safe but not the men. And the reason why is that the men? I can't remember how I abused women and I don't know how I'm used kids, but use your imagination. He was saying that about us men.

Speaker 2: 4:26

So my kids get back from the bathroom at that point and I say, go sit down And I'm not sitting with them, so they're right in front of me. So my girlfriend is very helpful. It's taking care of one of them, i take care of the other. But because he was focusing on the men, i had to make a decision. I had to make a decision between standing up to go sit next to my kids or staying behind them and not get the focus of his attention, because he's really focusing on men at this point. So I decided to just try to help my daughters rub their shoulders and say you're okay, don't worry, you're safe, and try to remind them of that.

Speaker 2: 5:03

So at one point he stands up and gets louder And he starts talking about Homeland Security. I think people said at air marshals, i'm pretty sure he had said Homeland Security. I say who's Homeland Security? And he started this is happening where three rows behind three to four rows. He's in front of us, so we hear him. We hear him pretty loudly. We are in this vision. If we decide to stand up, basically And he's starting to look at other men saying that, are you home, man? are you gonna shoot me? And if you do shoot me, the bullets will go right through me because I'm Baltazar and they won't kill me, and that's just me. I'll be safer. We can't remember the exact words.

Speaker 2: 5:40

So he states that at one point that he gets more and more upset. He gets up and he was up at that time too. I shouldn't say he just got up but at one point he starts stating that there will be a blood bath and then mentions a weapon of some sort. So then, at one point, because he got up I didn't see all that, because I'm hiding behind my daughters trying to rub their arms and I'll share that feeling afterwards and then he says he's gonna take over the plane. Thank you for the four to six men who really charged at him, pushed him down and held him down. The flight attendants helped and they started looking for zip ties in the cuffs. Well, the zip tie cuffs, i should say. He's held down, but the cuffs break. Then around. They start throwing the message around the plane that does anybody have their belt or ties or anything that they can use as a restraint? You know who goes on a plane anymore with belts, because you know everything. We gotta go through TSA right, so hard to find. So I'm all that.

Speaker 2: 6:41

After you got tackled, i asked a woman who was sitting next to my kids to get up and I start reassuring my kids. I talked to them, i processed them, you're safe, you're fine, talk about all those things And just wanna make sure they're okay. They have a lot of questions already about weapons. They have questions about what happened. Why is he that way? So try to answer as much as I can with the girls once they hear that he did not have a weapon. And I joke around that he didn't have a weapon because and this is not a joke At LAX we couldn't even wear our hoodies through the security.

Speaker 2: 7:14

They had to put that down. So I'm like, if we can't wear a hoodie, i'm pretty sure he's not bringing a weapon. So we're able to do that. My girlfriend had a prescribed medication, a benzodiazepine that I can't remember what it was. But she decides that she's gonna try to help. She grinds it he said he was thirsty, the gentleman in question, while he's being restrained. So she puts it in his mouth So hopefully by it gets absorbed and it comes in down. He's held down.

Speaker 2: 7:42

We're still like we're still in the air during all this time And originally 45 minutes in, we're over. I wanna guess New York, new Jersey, around there. But they took the plane all the way back to Logan. So people get tired and all that. So after I reassured my kids, i asked my kids if they need help. Do you want me to go help them and to restrain them? And they said, sure, but I didn't have to do that, thankfully, because they had asked once or twice but I didn't have to do anything. So ever my girlfriend, the dad, she goes and sits down.

Speaker 2: 8:14

We land in Logan pretty violently because the plane's coming at a really rapid rate. We wanna land ASAP. Obviously makes sense, right? So once we land, he's taken off the plane and like I don't think he was on, like as soon as the troopers got in, massachusetts State Police shot out to them too, by the way, they take him out right away. And then they said well, can you sit down? We're just gonna run people, we're gonna talk to people, get some statements. Some people had videos, so the state troopers needed that And they asked for more info, and the only thing I really offered is that if someone was saying something that was not accurate, i kind of like did correct them. So once the troopers or, as we say in Massachusetts, the troopers have leave the plane, we're told to leave and we all leave. People are supporting each other, people are very nice to each other And the flight attendant says something to the effect of thank you for flying United, which seems I'll get back to that too.

Speaker 2: 9:13

So a few things that I wanna mention, because this is what happened. I wanna give you the facts as much as I can, without putting my little messages in there, right? So here's my thoughts in regards to that. So the flight attendants were calm, they were amazing, they did a fantastic job, considering I will be honest, and I didn't see him with a weapon. I did not see it When I was in the bathroom. I didn't see him going towards anyone with the weapons because, again, i'm cowering behind the seat so that he doesn't see me because he is targeting men. But the flight attendants tried to calm the situation down. They did everything they can. They were helping as much as they can and they did a fantastic job, because I'm sure that there probably is some training in regards to emergency situations. I'm pretty sure they never had to go through that exact situation. So bravo and kudos to all of them for handling it well. Happy the flight attendant did not get stabbed that I know of and things went out okay that way. For the four to six men who ran and held them down, thank you. I try to shake hands with everyone when they went back to sit down, but I will never be able to thank them enough for what they did.

Speaker 2: 10:28

People next to me some of them were upset, some people were struggling, and I've worked crisis work for about 15 years. So I went into a mode where I again because I want to be very mindful that I cannot diagnose someone I don't know I was thinking there might be a mental health issue there, and if you want to laugh the way I said it, that's fine too. So you know I start. Someone of the women in particular was afraid of flying And obviously this didn't help. So I tried to talk to her. I talked to other people who were like having a rough time trying to just calm everyone down, including after I took care of my daughters, which were my priority right, so to care, but that was really good And people stayed really calm And I'm very happy for that. The few things that I want to mention that I got and it may be hard for me to get to this point, but I figured vulnerability and being truthful in regards to what we went through goes a long way.

Speaker 2: 11:25

So the first question I have is why didn't we land before Logan? Because we knew we would get tired. The zip ties had broken and we're like I said, we went over New York. I know there's a couple of airports there. We were near Hartford. There's an airport there, there's an airport in Worcester, there's an airport, smaller airports on the way And why did they insist on doing the 45 minutes to Boston? I'll never quite understand that. That's not for me to respond, but this is something that I really wanted to share because it got me frustrated. We only had one pair of zip tie cuffs on the whole plane. Why am I frustrated by that? Well, if we were two people who were acting out or trying to take over a plane or what have you, we were proverbially fucked And yes, i swore but it was just the frustration I had that we only had one pair. It was so scary in regards to that because the cuffs broke so they had to do.

Speaker 2: 12:23

Other things I saw also like again, there are no, there's no like order here. I'm just telling you my thoughts here and I did write them down. But the other thing that came like when we finished, i said, oh, thank you for everyone who helped, particularly those who and then thank you for flying United. I thought that was the most insulting thing I heard, and the reason why is that we went through a lot And I didn't like. I think that people who acted bravely like they did, is they went through even more to me. I frankly don't think of me as going through a whole lot, but thank you for flying United seems like a and you know, i know the flight attendants are going through their own stuff too. It's not that I'm insensitive to that, but at the same time, like I could have been a little better. Right, could have been like oh my God, i hope you're going to get an email from us, or if you need crisis resources or whatever. No, nothing of that. Thank you for flying United And we get off the plane and we get on a merry way, except for those that had the videos and wanted to give statements. So I didn't quite understand that and I'm still a little frustrated in regards to that right.

Speaker 2: 13:29

And there was no followup. I wrote to them in regards to that on Monday. My girlfriend did something on Tuesday or Wednesday and didn't follow up anything, and so I have my resources. I have my therapist. I'm a therapist myself. My therapist helped me. I was reaching out to people anyway, but ultimately, why aren't they reaching out to us? And yes, if you feel attacked United, it's not my goal, but I want to tell you that you failed us by doing so And I wish that that happened. You know the things I'm grateful for besides that is just having a bunch of people who are just united. You know, it was very helpful to see that My brain went into crisis mode.

Speaker 2: 14:12

As I said, the one thing that my therapist made me understand is that what also is painful for me is that I've had other traumas, not on a plane like this, but other traumas in my life And you know, a lot of it brings shame right, and this one brought me shame because if I took care of my kids, then I felt shame that I didn't help the men who bravely held them down And if I did help them out, i would have been ashamed that I wasn't there for my kids. You know, knock on wood, my kids still like, say you know it's a bad incident. They were even annoyed with me on Friday when I was asking how they were doing. And they're not effected And I'm very proud of that. I'm hoping that I contributed to that, but my shame was gonna come either way and I couldn't win, and that's a lot of the shit that I still struggle with right now.

Speaker 2: 15:02

The sadness of the whole thing, because for me it's just a sad statement of what happened, and not only for the mental health part, because that's part of what he had as an issue. In my opinion it's just an opinion. There's no proof of what I'm saying here But intense sadness for that poor woman who probably will never fly again And you know we didn't send any support for her, even for me, who has all the resources. Pretty rough for me too, and I'm sure there's other people who found that rough. Didn't find a rough, that's great. And yes, i think that what the men did was brave, even though they said they just did what was right. They did absolutely what was right. but doing what was right is tough And I give them a lot of credit for that. The flight attendants keeping the situation as calm as they possibly could give them a lot of credit. Still don't understand why we had to go 40 minutes in flight with this situation instead of landing somewhere else.

Speaker 2: 15:59

The other thing that's gonna be very vulnerable for me to say is that I was calm, i was fine on Sunday, even making jokes on the way back in the car, and dark humor really helped. My kids participated, my girlfriend participated And I was fine Monday when I wrote that email to United. But by Tuesday morning I was dry heaving And, to put that in perspective, i truly haven't had any problems with my digestive system in that way for many years I can't even count them in the years 15 years or so And I dry heaved a lot on Tuesday. I've dried heaved on Wednesday, thursday, friday, saturday, today's Sunday it's a week removed. I've dried heaved every day, even today, and that's a reaction. Right, i've cried and I'm surprised I haven't cried yet, but I think I writing it down and sharing with you was kind of like a good way for me not to cry, i guess, because I can keep my shit together sometimes.

Speaker 2: 17:01

But I tell the story to a few people. I don't wanna say this story, just for the record. Just the last time I'll say this story. If you're a friend of mine, if you're someone who knows me, i'm gonna refer you to the podcast. The reason why my therapist says retelling the story won't help. And he's right Damn you therapist. Thank you, joe. But I think that what happens is that it's tough. You just become a human. I'm not immune to trauma because I'm a therapist. I'm not immune to the side effects of acute stress disorder because I'm a therapist. And when I think about finding your way through therapy, i really wanted people to understand that we wanna help us therapists, but therapists are human too And I really really wanted that to be shown And I figured that this is the perfect place to talk about that.

Speaker 2: 17:58

How am I gonna be tomorrow, next week, i don't know, but I know that just talking about it felt good to share that with everyone, and if you have any questions that are not about the event, but how I'm feeling or anything like that, i'm more than happy to share that. I'm not sharing any of my personal views in regards to certain things, but I will tell you how I feel And that's what I will concentrate on. So that's it. I didn't know how I was gonna finish the episode. There's gonna be the end of the episode here. We'll go back to a regular schedule program next week, but I appreciate you guys listening.

Speaker 2: 18:37

It's so tough sometimes to just be a human being because I wanna be a professional, but even this week, having a few clients, one of the things I've always prided myself is that don't ask me any questions you don't want the answer to, and one of the questions I've done since a long time is if you ask me how I'm doing, i'm gonna tell you exactly how I'm doing, whether you like it or not. I don't care, and I've said that to a few people. I've been able to kind of like, give them the cliff notes and not be too emotional. But one of the things that I said to myself a long time ago is, if you can be human as a therapist, you can let them be humans in life. And there was a particular client this week. I was sharing a little bit about this And turns out that this client of mine started talking about their trauma that they had a couple of weeks ago And they said you talking about it, just open myself, that I can be vulnerable with you. So again, i don't know how to end this episode other than saying that my clients first they listened a little bit I didn't take over their sessions. I was very every time I did I said no, my God, i can't take over your session. And they would always go no, no, you can tell me I'm like no, no, this is your session Because you know part of it is. I know some therapists friends of mine will say well, you shared too much with your clients. This is not something we should be doing. You're taking over the session. I didn't get the impression from any of my clients that they felt that way And I'm pretty sure they didn't.

Speaker 2: 20:02

But ultimately I'll be myself on this podcast. I can guarantee you that I'll be authentic. I'll be myself. My reactions are authentic. Right now I'm feeling okay. I do feel the tears in my eyes. I'm gonna put the video in on YouTube if you wish. But I know that I'll get better. But I won't get better by holding the story down and not talking about it. I won't talk about the story, but how I feel, and I was.

Speaker 2: 20:29

I've been able to, between talking to a great, great friend of mine on Tuesday, being able to talk to a few more people Wednesday and Thursday, going out with a friend again on Friday. Yesterday, i was able to talk to another friend. We did something, we had something planned and was able to open up with him, and then today went with my girlfriend's friends and we, you know, kind of like, share that story too. One of the things I would say to make sure that things don't become a, you know, post-traumatic stress disorder or acute stress disorder, is to talk about it, and not necessarily the event, but your feelings and how you felt around this. Do you do that with just about everyone? No, do it with people you trust. But ultimately, it's really been helpful for me to be able to open up about it. So, all right, now it's the end.

Speaker 2: 21:16

Thank you and welcome to episode 96 of Finding Your Way Through Therapy. If you haven't listened to episode 95 with Michelle LaRoe Alves, please go back and listen to it, because we talked about relationship, we talked about a bunch of great stuff and I truly enjoyed that interview. But episode 96 will be quite an update on different things. So let's start off with that intro. I just love that intro. I had someone do a voiceover for the intro and the outro. I really listened to both. I do enjoy having that because I don't have to introduce myself. It feels a little more professional. I hope you feel the difference. And as we go along, you know, i hope that we go from season one to season eight and CD Evolution that I truly want to see.

Speaker 2: 21:58

I also want to talk about season eight because on the week of my 100th episode, which will be on the week of May 15th, i'm going to try to have a new podcast every single day. I love you guys to listen to it. I'm trying to do something quite unique. I'm not going to tell you what you got You'll have to tune in, but let's say we have returning guests, we have new guests and we have people who know me, and they know me as either their friends or someone they've known for a long time. So I'm hoping you get a chance to go and listen to that, because it's going to be awesome, i think.

Speaker 2: 22:29

Anyway, the other thing that I wanted to talk about is I had a special episode in season seven I think it was between episode 92 and 91. And it talked about a flight that I was on from LA to Boston. I'm not going to recount it per my therapist, but also because I respect me and myself and I don't want to really go back into it, but it was pretty traumatic. So go back and listen to it. There's no number to it because it was a special episode and I was a little upset, i was a little anxious. I did it about a week post the flight, so you can hear real emotions.

Speaker 2: 23:04

And one of the things that I want to say first of all before I go on is thank you for all of you who said notes concerns texts, email. I think that this was the episode I got the most feedback on ever And people were checking on me. They didn't really ask me for stories. They didn't ask me for anything else, but, hey, are you okay? You know I'm here for you, and this goes from listeners that I didn't know existed, frankly, and also from friends and family that I've known for a while or I haven't talked to in a while, and they were checking on me and I truly appreciate it. I'm doing much better. I hope you can hear it in my voice. It's something that was, you know, like it's still. Say that it is a little difficult and I hope to continue being able to talk about it in the future. I want to give you the update that my kids are still fine, my girlfriend is fine And I'm doing pretty much okay. I realize a few things, but I'll leave that to my therapist. But let's just say what I said in the episode about this bringing up something from the past was definitely accurate And one of the things that I got as feedback from a couple of people who are my clients or have known me as a therapist.

Speaker 2: 24:15

They said that you preach authenticity and you preach being real. You did that in that episode And that meant so much to me. I still I'm not crying right now, but I do have a tear in my eye, because that's exactly what I wanted to mimic, and the hardest thing in life is to be ourselves, and what I mean by that is this we are thought socially to be a certain way, and when you're a therapist, we talk about professionalism. Coaching is the same thing, and I think that being professional is overrated, and what I mean by that is, of course, i believe in certain boundaries, etiquette, the quorum, as I've said before to a couple of people, and I hope you know who you are But I also think that being ourselves is important. As a therapist, i think that the old Freudian suit and tie sitting at the top of a couch is no longer something that's going on as much, and I'm sure that there is space for that, don't get me wrong. But you know, i think that the therapists that we have nowadays are much more real, and what I mean by that is they talk about things that are related to real life, and for me, i've always tried to be very authentic with my clients And I think that by having a podcast that is as authentic has brought me a lot of good feedback.

Speaker 2: 25:30

I don't ever want to change that about myself. I think that what happens is we are in a world where authenticity sometimes can be seen as a sign of weakness. I talk about a balance, and what I mean by that is this I'm a big fan of Debbie Ford the late, great Debbie Ford, and it's called the dark side of light chasers. If you ever get a chance, go get that book. I don't make a dime, but I'll link it in my show notes. But Debbie Ford was someone who was instrumental in my work. This was a gift that was given to me by my supervisor. Like this was my internship and my whatever they call it the other thing, practicum, i think And she gave me that book to read and it talks about how we can't move compulsively from one thing to another.

Speaker 2: 26:16

So if we're, example, afraid of being authentic, we try to be way over professional, and that's not healthy for anyone. If you think of yourself as being strong, there's fear that you're gonna be weak and so on and so forth. And for me, i was always thought that you need to professional, you need to use the right language, you need to be using something that is like within the books, and I think I go buy the book for the most part in the sense that I make it about the client. I work on the things they wanna work on. I move them forward in what they wanna do, but ultimately, i also talk about my own shit, and I think that it's important to do so, and what I mean by that is this My clients feel like I when I share a story about something that relates to what they're saying and how I worked on it, or if another client had worked on something similar and I share that story, never give names, of course. I think that makes it that much more authentic, that much more real, and so I think that what I'm gonna continue preaching with everyone is authenticity, and I'm gonna keep on doing that.

Speaker 2: 27:15

One final note about that flight. I've been in contact with United and I'm happy to report that they are working on something. What they are working on is to probably make some sort of message when there is an incident like that, to address the mental health crisis that may occur, and I think that that's great customer service. I'm looking forward to hearing more. I've had a few follow-ups with them. They're supposed to probably try to get to me when they finish up what they're gonna introduce, but I can't really say much more because I wanna be respectful, but I will say that United customer service, as much as I was not too happy at the beginning, have been keeping me in the loop in regards to changing some of these policies that they have, so I'm very happy about that. Otherwise, still going to therapy, still working on stuff, and still happy that people still talk to me in a way that they're very supportive and understand that this was not an easy thing to happen. What I've also noted is I've seen a lot of people have different reactions to it, whether it's in the media and the news, what have you And what I've realized is that what's traumatic to one is not to another and vice versa. And I think that this I'm the proof And I can honestly say that I'm the proof of that And I wanna make sure my listeners know that and that hopefully they can relate to me a little more, that if they have any more questions about it they can ask me. But ultimately I just wanna kind of like decide to be more authentic even more on my podcast, if you can believe that, and I wanna be authentic in my own life and I'm hoping I continue doing so.

Speaker 2: 28:56

Episode 97 will feature someone called Pavel Yitzal. You wanna hear his story. You absolutely wanna hear his story of courage and survival and everything else, and I hope you join me then. Well, this concludes episode 107 and also concludes season eight of Finding Your Way Through Therapy. So happy that we got to the end of this one This was a long one Enjoyed it, but also kind of happy to move on. It's gonna be a short season for season nine, but I will be meeting with what we used to call a group And I know that it may be taken in a different way, but we were called the mental men and this is Pat Rice, which has been on the show before, then three new guests Dennis Sweeney, dr Robert Cherney feels weird to say it that way And Andrew Kang, which again is weird to say, because that's not how I usually talk to them, but this is a group, that's important. They're gonna be the first episode for season nine. I hope you join me then.

Speaker 1: 29:55

Please like, subscribe and follow this podcast on your favorite platform. A glowing review is always helpful And, as a reminder, this podcast is for informational, educational and entertainment purposes only. If you're struggling with a mental health or substance abuse issue, please reach out to a professional counselor for consultation. If you are in a mental health crisis, call 988 for assistance. This number is available in the United States.