Resilience Development in Action
Discover practical resilience strategies that transform lives. Join Steve Bisson, licensed mental health counselor, as he guides first responders, leaders, and trauma survivors through actionable insights for mental wellness and professional growth.
Each week, dive deep into real conversations about grief processing, trauma recovery, and leadership development. Whether you're a first responder facing daily challenges, a leader navigating high-pressure situations, or someone on their healing journey, this podcast delivers the tools and strategies you need to build lasting resilience.
With over 20 years of mental health counseling experience, Steve brings authentic, professional expertise to every episode, making complex mental health concepts accessible and applicable to real-world situations.
Featured topics include:
• Practical resilience building strategies
• First responder mental wellness
• Trauma recovery and healing
• Leadership development
• Grief processing
• Professional growth
• Mental health insights
• Help you on your healing journey
Each week, join our community towards better mental health and turn your challenges into opportunities for growth with Resilience Development in Action.
Resilience Development in Action
E.120 A Tale of Survival: Navigating Past Abuse, Addiction, and the Justice System
What would you do if you were forced to confront a dark chapter from your past after 15 years? Join us as Lynn Kee, a survivor and embodiment of resilience, opens up about her painful journey towards recovery from childhood sexual abuse and addiction. Lynn dives deep into the legal repercussions she navigated, illustrating how the justice system can, unfortunately, contribute to secondary trauma for survivors.
Lynn's narrative is a powerful testament to survival and courage. She recounts the chilling moment she encountered her offender, despite having a lifetime stay away order, shedding light on the emotional turmoil and legal complexities involved in such situations. But there's more. Lynn also discusses her struggle with addiction and how navigating the healthcare system became a tumultuous journey layered with additional challenges. She underscores the crucial role of trauma-informed care and the urgent need for specialty case management services for those dealing with similar circumstances.
Finally, we delve into a heartening discussion about AJ's Way, a beacon of hope in the form of a non-profit organization being set up in remembrance of Lynn's sister, Amanda Hernandez. This initiative aims to support others embarking on their recovery journey. This episode is a riveting collision of trauma, addiction, and legal implications, shining a light on the often overlooked perspectives of survivors. Don't miss out on this opportunity to learn, empathize, and grow alongside Lynn's inspiring story.
Hi and welcome to Finding your Way Through Therapy. The goal of this podcast is to demystify therapy, what can happen in therapy and the wide array of conversations you can have in and about therapy Through personal experiences. Guests will talk about therapy, their experiences with it and how psychology and therapy are present in many places in their lives, with lots of authenticity and a touch of humor. Here is your host, steve Bisson.
Speaker 2:Merci, effiniman. Thank you and welcome to Episode 120. If you haven't listened to Episode 119 yet, please go back and listen to it. This is a very important documentary called First Responders in Crisis, and I had the privilege to have one of the main people from the documentary, as well as the director-producer and another director-producer, so please go back and listen to that.
Speaker 2:But for Episode 120, we're bringing back Lynn Key. Lynn is someone who was on Episode 109 and 110. She discussed her grooming and sexual abuse that she went through, as well as the following substance use and addiction, the loss of her sister. On Episode 120, she's going to talk about the legal ramification of all this and what happens after there's a conviction. So I hope you enjoy the interview and here it is. Well, hi everyone and welcome to Episode 120 of Finding your Way Through Therapy.
Speaker 2:I am Steve Bisson and I'm so excited to have Lynn Key back. She was on Episode 109, episode 110, and we needed to talk about the legal ramification of her whole story. And what's interesting is that when you know your story and you know what you went through and all that, that's easy sometimes to say back for some people, some others it's hard, but ultimately, right now the hardest part is going to be to talk about these legal ramification, because they are complex and they are frustrating and they're demanding, and we are not here to destroy anyone's character, but rather make sure that other people don't have those same issues. So as we navigate this together, I want to introduce Lynn Key. Hi, steve.
Speaker 3:How are you?
Speaker 2:today. You know what it's been a day and very happy to have you on again. I want to mention that I want everyone to go back to 109 and 110 to hear your story. I would say that I got positive feedback from just about everyone and people really felt that they got a full story from your point of view and they really enjoy that. So I want to mention that to you. I think I told you privately, but let's put it on the show too. But now let's talk a little more about you, and I know that if people haven't gone down yet to 109 and 110 to listen to it yet, how about you do a quick introduction of yourself?
Speaker 3:Yes, steve, absolutely. First and foremost, I want to say thank you so much for having me back again. I truly appreciate the time and energy you've put into helping me to tell my story and get this stuff out there. The number one thing I'm concerned about is helping others with my story, so I do just wicked wicked appreciate that. So just to reintroduce myself, my name is Lynn Key and obviously I am from a small town called Northbridge, massachusetts.
Speaker 3:Both myself and my sister were survivors of childhood sexual abuse. Both of us went through the process with the justice system. Both of us also subsequently became addicts. We struggled with trauma, obviously, and the substance abuse issues that resulted from that trauma. Unfortunately, my sister lost her battle with her complex PTSD and the substance abuse that resulted from that back in January of this year. I myself have been blessed and lucky enough to make it into recovery once or a little under a decade. It's about seven years straight and then again after a brief relapse due to surgeries and stuff like that, I've been in recovery for about two years. So that is who I am and what I'm here to talk about essentially.
Speaker 2:And Lynn, when you go back to those podcasts, we'll give you a fair warning that the first one especially talks about a grooming experience and sexual abuse that she went through. And for those of you who feel like that might be too graphic, giving you the heads up to me as a therapist, as a person who's seen it through my whole career, your story was essential for people to hear that they're not alone and that you can survive this and you can fight it back. So I thank you for sharing your story. That was so essential to other people who have been victims and have told me that. And then normalizing the fact that not everyone's going to go through this.
Speaker 2:But, unfortunately, because you don't have all the coping mechanism and I'm not picking on you, lynn obviously you know that you start going to different types of things you avoid it or you go to substances to avoid it and what have you. So it's a continuous battle. I don't think anyone ever wins the addiction war ever, but we definitely conquer it and we definitely develop skills, and the strength that it takes to be sober for any amount of time to me is something I admire, so I wanted to mention that too.
Speaker 3:Oh, thank you so much. I appreciate it, steve. It's a hard fought battle and I know my sister was fighting very hard as well, unfortunately when she passed away, so I do appreciate that.
Speaker 2:I'm just done with people telling me that it doesn't affect them, when in fact it affects one out of four people, and if you know four people, that means you know one person. So I want to make sure I emphasize that and you're a hard work in treatment in order to get to where you're at, whether it's the self-help groups or in treatment in general, because that's something you mentioned in the other podcast, 110. And I want to mention that too, because treatment does work and obviously that's part of your story and I really want to share that too. But now that we're going to the third part of your story and to me, I worked in the legal system since probably 2003-ish, when I graduated out of my master's program and I knew how much of a headache it was, and that's from someone who, other than the divorce, not having and, knock on wood, not having to deal with the legal system myself I'm sure that you don't hope that I ever have to deal with it either, but let's talk about that, because I knew it was nightmarish.
Speaker 2:I could see it in my clients and this is by far what I always knew about the SOAR or we nicknamed it SOAR, but it's called the Sex Offender Registry Board in Massachusetts. So I want to make sure we use all the terms for people who are listening, who may not know them. I mean, there's so many headaches that I don't even want, I don't even know where to start. Lynn, I'll be honest with you and I want you to start because it's your story. The legal system has not been kind throughout the years to you.
Speaker 3:Yes. So I think the first thing to say is that for me, steve and I think the research is proving it more and more as time goes on Trauma is the gateway drug and that certainly proved to be the case for both my sister and I. My sister's name, my sister's name, no problem. That's my message. My sister's name was Amanda Hernandez. I just want to put that out there. I feel she should be remembered as an individual as well as in context of the greater message. But for both of us it played out that way and the justice system is both a path to healing to a certain extent, because obviously you hopefully get some semblance of accountability and punishment for lack of a better term for the offender. But in addition, it is also and in our case it certainly was extremely, extremely re-traumatizing. It's a secondary trauma and unfortunately for me personally, that was not just the case at the time of the original prosecution, trial and conviction of my offender.
Speaker 3:Just to remind people if they have forgotten my sister's story, my sister's offender was convicted but ran from the courthouse on the day of his conviction as the jury was coming back. He was on the lam for about two years and America's most wanted actually apprehended him. For me, my offender, it took six years from the time of the offense to the completion of the process and two trials to convict him. My offender was sentenced to about four years in prison three to four years, with five years to be served. After the fact, I was told that there would be five years of probation to be served. After the fact, I was told that there would be lifetime sex offender registration. He'd be classed when he was released. I was also told that there would be a lifetime stay away order.
Speaker 2:So that's part of what the message is right Lifetime is not lifetime.
Speaker 3:Well, come to find out, and this is the thing. I remained blissfully unaware of some of this up until very recently. My sister's offender was sentenced to 15 to 18 and he was going to serve an additional two years for running. We were told same conditions when it came to registration and the stay away, but he was in this country illegally so he was also to be deported by ICE Again. At the time of my sister's death we had a countdown of about three to four years until the time he was set to be released and deported.
Speaker 3:But at the time of my sister's death she was concerned about that, but it wasn't like a thing that was in her day to day consciousness. For me, my offender and what was going on with him certainly was not in my day to day consciousness. I had put that behind me. I was working to overcome my addiction. It wasn't like I was sitting around using because I was thinking about the rape. I was using because of the trauma and the maladaptive coping mechanisms that come from dealing with the symptoms of said trauma which, as we discussed, tend to mirror the symptoms of active addiction just in a different way. My sister was also very trauma affected. If you don't mind, I'll just get into how this all came back into our day to day lives, our consciousness.
Speaker 2:Please do. I want to hear more about what happened with you, because the reason why I set it up also is that lifetime doesn't mean lifetime. Yes, that's something that anyone who has been a victim never mind of any crime, but particularly sex crimes, need to hear, and this is what the message is here.
Speaker 3:Yeah, and unfortunately it's a life sentence for us.
Speaker 1:Right regardless of whether or not.
Speaker 3:Exactly, and for my sister, arguably a death sentence. Unfortunately, you know, it's just the reality of the situation. So, for me, what happened is I was early in my recovery and I've been a member of a church. Well, since the day I was born I've been involved with the church, right. But I've been a member of this particular church around the town that I grew up in since I was about 12 years old. My nanny, my grandmother, my paternal grandmother, was a member of that church. She got buried out of that church, right, but I hadn't been in person in quite some time.
Speaker 3:I attended virtually on Sundays, which didn't include, for me, the praise music, right, because I just wanted to see the sermon. That was the main reason. I listened to praise music in my car all the time, though it's kind of funny, the things that stick with us, right. So it was Monday, thursday, which, if you don't know anything about, you know the quote unquote Christian religion, right, is the Thursday night before Good Friday, and Good Friday is the Friday before Easter, and it happened to be both my nanny and I's favorite religious service of the year. So I thought, you know, might as well go. So I got a ride because at this time again, I didn't have my license, I didn't have a vehicle. I was a couple of months clean. This was April of not this past year, but the year before and I had gotten clean December 26th Yep, yep, I had gotten clean December 26th of 2021.
Speaker 2:So this was early 2022.
Speaker 3:Yeah, then, this is my second stint in sobriety, or, you know, in sobriety because this is my first real recovery, but yeah, this is my first real recovery, if that makes sense, the first time working a program.
Speaker 3:So anyway, I go to church and I walk into the sanctuary with my fiance, we go to sit down and back left side of the church and the praise band is on stage and they are, you know, playing praise music, which is one of my favorite parts of the service when I'm there in person. It's how I really connect with my higher power, if that makes sense. If you have watched the previous episodes, and even if you haven't, I'll say it I am a singer. I've been a singer since I was little. I play guitar.
Speaker 3:My offender was actually my guitar teacher, so as well, you know, as a firefighter on my dad's department. So essentially I look up and standing on stage for lack of a better term, if you've ever been in a congregational church, it's almost like a stage as opposed to like an altar. You know, in a Catholic church is a man and this is the best way to describe it for me in that moment is a man who looked just like my offender and I immediately was like that can't possibly be my offender, because at the time I knew this person. He didn't even believe in God, like he wasn't even sure he believed in God. In addition to that, this is the church I was going to at the time that this situation was happening, and this was a grooming situation, as you said, steve. This man knew everything about me.
Speaker 3:In addition to that, I went to a Christian camp every summer which is actually where I reported and that was affiliated with the church. It wasn't run by the church, but the church sent all its kids to this camp, and this camp testified against this gentleman. So not only would this gentleman although this gentleman looked just like him that was standing in front of me, and although this man that raped me played guitar, there was no way. Not only would he not be like at a church in general, but he would certainly not be at this particular church.
Speaker 2:So, as I'm standing, here Just before you go on. Yeah, and I take the in consideration. How long ago was it?
Speaker 3:This was. I last saw him in 2006, when he was taken out of the, out of the courtroom.
Speaker 2:I just want to make sure that people here, because 2006, 2020, in 14 years, we all change. I mean, that's something to keep in mind here, so please go ahead, yeah, and this and again.
Speaker 3:This was 2022 because I got clean in December of 21.
Speaker 1:Sorry about this, so this was 2022.
Speaker 3:So it was over 15 years, right Since I had last seen this man. So I'm standing there and I didn't react because, again, this can't possibly be real and he is a good I don't know at least 30 to 50 feet Not that far, but 30 to 50 feet in front of me. I'm at the back, he's at the front and I'm standing there staring. So after about five minutes of this, I realized like there's no way that this is not this man. He looked exactly as I remember him and I just knew that it was him, and so then I kind of started to freak out a little bit internally to say the least.
Speaker 2:So just for the record, freak out is a misnomer.
Speaker 3:I think the right words.
Speaker 2:I'm going to translate what she said and hopefully you understand. My first language is French, so I'm good at translation. What the fuck is the translation that I want to make? Go ahead.
Speaker 3:Accurate. It was a what the fuck moment, steve.
Speaker 2:You didn't say that, but I translate really well.
Speaker 3:Yeah, to say the least, it really was. So I tapped because we're in a church, we're in a church, people are worshiping, and this man is on stage, he is participating in the production of the worship music. So I can't exactly just start yelling and screaming, so I turn, which is what, like I wanted to.
Speaker 2:You're just screaming in your head, but go ahead.
Speaker 3:Yeah. So I turned to my fiance and I tap him and I draw him closer and I say in his ear like you see the guy playing guitar right there. And I pointed and he said yeah. And I said I'm pretty sure that that is Mimmer Murr. And he's like what do we do? Literally that's what he said. He goes, what do we do? Cause he's never seen this guy before. I don't even believe he's ever seen a picture of this guy. This is so far in my past. He knows it's happened to me, obviously, but he has no idea who this guy is. So he said what do we do? And in that moment, right, I just kind of realized that there is a stay away now. This is at the time and that's very important. I'm like there's a lifetime stay away so he might not know that I'm here right now, although I can't believe he forgot that this is my church. So that's a little weird and I don't like that at all and that was a very uncomfortable feeling too. I still don't understand that.
Speaker 2:And uncomfortable again to translate retraumatize. Please go ahead.
Speaker 3:Yeah, very much so, cause there was a lot of questions there and I'm sure we'll get into that.
Speaker 2:But I just want to put it always in context and use real words, because I know that we want to be very mindful as to saying what we can say, but I also need to put it in words and therapy, because people like, oh, it's disconcerting, no, it's fucked up. You need to be able to see the reality and that's what the hopefully, what I you're doing with lifting some of the stigma and explaining these things, but for me, as a therapist who wants this podcast to be bringing people to therapy, let's use real words also. So you don't need to use the real words. I know you're very polite. I finally broke you from calling me sir.
Speaker 1:Oh, I'll do it at some point. I know you will probably do it again.
Speaker 2:But ultimately I want to make sure we use proper, like literally proper language, not in the Queens words, but real words, and to me that's proper language. Please go ahead.
Speaker 3:And thank you for you know what. Thank you for reminding me of that Cause very much so lately I've been in the intellectual sphere when it comes to this. I've been talking to a lot of people about this situation to point out the various different like legislative and procedural and policy failures that exist to have allowed for this in the first place. I've been talking about, you know, solutions for the trauma that causes people to end up in addiction and solutions for the holes in the system that allow people like my sister to slip through the cracks, and I forget that I'm living through some really difficult shit. My number one response or coping mechanism is to intellectualize things anyway. So when I'm like trying to spread a message right Like, that's exactly where I go.
Speaker 2:Now we know you're in therapy. But, let me ask you a question here. So you had, let's go back to where you were saying and really just go into the legal aspect of it here yes For a second Lifetime, stay away.
Speaker 3:Oh, yes, sir, Yep, what does that mean?
Speaker 2:See, you did it again. I did it, yes, sir.
Speaker 3:Yes, sir. So anyway, lifetime stay away. Now, at that moment that I'm standing in the church, lifetime to me means a friggin' lifetime For the rest of my life, for the rest of his life. Whoever goes longer, you know, wins. I guess, right, and there's no more lifetime stay away order at that point. But until that moment there is a stay away order, at no point can he come near me. And if he comes near me and obviously he has to know he's near me and all that stuff, see that I'm there If he does not move away at that point, he is in trouble legally, like one would imagine a restraining order or a harassment order would be so at that moment.
Speaker 2:I'm thinking Whereas we thought.
Speaker 3:Yeah, I'm thinking in that moment. It is his responsibility to move away from me. This is my church. Last time I checked he knew this was my church. Don't know why it's here, but we'll deal with that later. I'm not gonna disrupt the service. I'm going to stand here in my power and worship my God and, honestly, like that is one of my major coping mechanisms, is my faith. So I got on my knees and I got into the music and I cried hysterically and it was a very powerful moment for me to be kneeling there worshiping my God to music being played by my rapist, who shouldn't have even been there because the camp I went to out of that church testified against him Like that makes no sense who in that moment shouldn't even be there because there's a stay-away order. Who arguably shouldn't even be there because how does that even happen? He's exposed to a vulnerable population in a position like worship team at a church like that, his target population. So that's how I dealt with it. Now, as the service progressed right, there was communion.
Speaker 3:So after he was done playing, he actually got off the stage, and this is another thing I didn't know was gonna happen, walked down off the stage and sat about three rows in front of me with two small children, and in that moment I realized that he was there with his children and I was looking for his wife. I did not see her, but he was there with his two children. So now I really can't lose my shit.
Speaker 1:Really can't.
Speaker 3:There are two small children involved. I haven't seen this man since his daughter had not been born yet. His wife was pregnant with his daughter at the time of the sentencing. So, for all I knew, these children didn't even know that their father was a sex offender, let alone that they were at the church and arguably, I would assume at that point he's in the worship team going to a church that victim attended.
Speaker 3:So it was stressful, to say the least, when communion was called and it was time to get out of the pew and go up for communion, because at that point I'm now standing in line and he is three rows in front of me, and as I'm standing there with my fiance, I realized that we are going to be very close to one another and there's really nothing I can do about it. So for about it felt like an eternity, but I'm guessing it was probably like three to five minutes. For approximately three to five minutes I was within about I could have reached out and touched him. Yeah, that's not an exaggeration, I could have reached, I could have reached out and touched him. And there's a crowd, there's a sea of people, because people are converging on the middle row from all these rows and it's a large church. But I could have touched him and much like he looks, exactly the same.
Speaker 3:I Look very much the same. I'm the same weight. I have not aged terribly. I don't think my voice is quite distinctive. I'm sitting there and I'm talking. I'm standing there, I'm talking to my, to my fiance, you know now, I didn't make a point to make myself known to this man, okay, but there's no way that he did not know that I was there at no point in time. Does he move away from me? And you can argue that that could have impacted his children, I guess. Sure, I'm sure he could have made some excuse, though, like he did not need to right do that, he didn't.
Speaker 2:So I'm gonna jump forward here, if you don't mind. Go for it, please do you get out of church, mm-hmm. I mean, the standard question would be how you're feeling, but I'm pretty sure I know how you're feeling at this point, without being too arrogant here about knowing other people feel.
Speaker 3:Yeah, but I was pretty fucked up, steve. We'll just so. We'll just put it that way I was pretty fucked up.
Speaker 2:So how do we deal with going like okay, do I contact a lawyer, do I contact the police? Do I can't? What the hell do I do legally? Because this is a really yes.
Speaker 3:Well, I knew in that moment I had protection right, or I thought I knew, and it would turn out that I did not, and we'll get into that. Many layers of protection that I thought I had I did not have. But we'll get into that Right. So the first thing I did was, again I used my coping skills. So first and foremost, I'd thank God for like getting me through that experience. It was a powerful, right experience like in more ways than in that moment I could understand. It was incredibly powerful.
Speaker 3:I thanked God that I didn't want to get high, because I didn't, and that was very, very noticeable because, because and I say that for a Reason, and that reason is other people need to know that that happens and it can happen quickly. You have to remember I was only a few months Into my recovery this time around. At that point and that is a major event I I Disassociated in a major way. Once the once, the feeling of what happened set in. Once I was through the initial coping mechanism that I believe is automatic and I think the science backs that up as well of Just kind of like pushing through and figuring out what the f happened. At that point I disassociated for like fuzzy feeling is what disassociating is like. I couldn't concentrate on anything. Everything was overwhelming. You had to like lead me by the nose, to like get me through it the day, ah, the next day and kind of the day after that. So, like, clearly I was very upset, but I was grateful that in that moment I did not want to Get high and that was Amazing.
Speaker 3:I spoke to my fiancee about it, tried to figure out what the fuck I do next. I called either. I Don't remember who it was, so I'm not gonna pick somebody, but it was one of my closest supporters. I called someone. I talked it through with that person and I decided like that was a lot, so I'm not gonna call anybody tonight, but first thing tomorrow I'm calling somebody because there is a stay-away order and bare minimum he should have moved away from me.
Speaker 3:However, I want to know how he's even in that position. How is he in that position? Because there's no way that this church I know this church, I've been involved with this church forever the pastor is, and I'm not saying that this doesn't happen, because it does. Obviously I was groomed by a very trusted family friend and employee who nobody expected to have grew me, but I could not imagine that they would give themselves that type of liability, put it that way, steve. So that that's what I did at that point. I went home, I went to bed next day, next day I called the police. So I'll tell you a little bit about that if you'd like, real quick.
Speaker 2:That was weird.
Speaker 2:It was weird to call the police like and just just for the record for those who I want to make it again clear about what happens. The association you will call someone and you're gonna be like, who the fuck do I call? And this is not abnormal, because that is a good look. It's a trauma response and people you know trauma, trauma. Okay, let's, let me. Let me just explain what that response is. You need to survive and if you go back to the moment of where you were with that person in trauma, you relive it. It's gonna be worse.
Speaker 2:So the association, in some weird ways, a great defense mechanism so you don't fall back to that. And I want to explain it because some people like, oh, I dissociate, that's terrible. I'm like sometimes could be your best life saving thing. Oh yeah, so that's why she can't remember. And I wanted to explain that as a therapist, because it's important to realize if we always think that Dissociation is bad or whatever is bad, you gotta realize sometimes that's the best coping mechanism that we have at that time. Let me hear about your phone call to the police.
Speaker 3:Yes, and thank you for that, steve, because that's what being trauma informed is all about. So I just want to make that point, because a lot of what I'm gonna be talking about later on is about the differences between dealing with professionals and services that have trauma informed people working for them and Not, and there is a big difference there, um so anyway. So I I called the police in the town that the church was located in the next day and it was a weird scenario because I'm like look, hey, I was the victim of rape 20 years ago. This gentleman was a close family and friend and a fireman on my dad's department you might know my dad, this is a surrounding town, whatever and they did this. Obviously I'm just saying you know what I mean like this guy should have been held to a higher standard as a fireman and instead was was raping the daughter of his chief. So essentially Not a good dude. There's a lifetime stay away. He is a, at the time, level two sex offender. Last time I checked, not quite sure why, he's playing at a church he knew I attended. You know not quite sure how that went down, don't know what to do, but he was within, you know, three feet of me max for like three to five minutes last night, did not move away. I just want to know what happened. Please can you count me? And? And that's the conversation that I had with the officer.
Speaker 3:Now, again, I'm like there's a crime here. But, dude, look the officer. Looks this gentleman up right and he's like well, I'm not seeing a stay away. I am seeing the convictions, for you know, four counts of rape of a child back in, oh, six, I am seeing the, the restraining order, because at the time it was restraining order that was in place leading up to that's. But I'm not seeing anything else. Let me look into this. I'm gonna look into this and I'm gonna, I'm gonna give you a call back and I'm like okay, well, um, that's weird. But also, he, he raped me, right, and he was convicted of raping me. So maybe it's just like in with the conviction. It's not like a thing that just like pops up right away.
Speaker 2:Um, and in Massachusetts. Just to clear up, level one is the lowest level of sex offender, level three is the highest, so he was the second level, just yes, I wanted to explore that there, just so that in case people don't know how that works right, and it's.
Speaker 3:It's based on the crime itself, yes, but it's also based based on the risk of reoffense, and that it is also important to talk about at some point in this conversation.
Speaker 2:We'll get on. I know we're gonna. We're gonna talk about one thing right now. It's based upon how good your lawyer was. That's excuse me, but if that, if you said it. I don't really care if it offends you, but that's exactly what it is. Yeah and if, if sword wants to contact me, you know where to find me. All right, please continue, lynn. I apologize, need to say yes.
Speaker 3:No, it's cool, so, so, yeah. So at that point I put the, the police and the church piece of it behind me, because they're gonna do their job Right. That's the best I can do. I've had to learn that you can only do what you can do, and then you got to let the system do what the system does, and then you know you might have to adjust course, and that's that right. So what I did do, though, is I called my victim witness advocate.
Speaker 3:Now, my victim witness advocate is an amazing human being. She has been working for the Middlesex County District Attorney's Office Since shortly before Getting assigned to my case a couple years, maybe like brand new, essentially at the time and she still works there to this day. So we have been in close contact over the years for various different reasons. You know inquiring about various services when it came to like trying to get help for both mine and my sister's addiction. There, at one point, was an appeal that my sister's offender won, and so we had to deal with that as a family.
Speaker 3:This woman so happened to also have been assigned to my sister's case, so it was all very centralized through this one woman. So who did I want to call to get actual advice on what the hell my rights were, what my protections were and what to do from here. And Just also to be like. Can you effing believe that this dude had the gall to come and play in a praise band at the church that his victim Belong to at the time of the offense? Like that he had no reason to believe I would not still be going to that church. Do you get what I'm saying? Like it's just crazy.
Speaker 3:It's insane to me and I had been to that church within within a few years time and he wasn't playing. So this was recent for all intents and purposes. Like I knew, it had to have been in the last couple of years and that just made no sense to me. Still does not make any sense to me. So, basically, I call this lady, the victim witness advocate, who I like consider a friend at this point. She has been so close to my family for so many years. It's insane. And she is equally as Lord agrees. There's no way, like how could he not know and how was he in that position in the first place? Because we're guessing the church has some sort of Standard operating procedure which, by the way they did, we'll get there. It just wasn't followed to rule out sex offenders and you know what's his current status we needed to look into and you know what's the state of the stay away and accept, like how do we go about getting after that Etc, etc. Etc, etc.
Speaker 3:A couple of days later she gets back to me. I believe this is the order of operations because, again, the memory of the specifics is sometimes there but the timeline is not. And sometimes the timeline is super clear, but that it's more rare than not that the timeline is a little fuzzy. The details are always clear, though. So she gets back to me and she goes look, lynn, this problem paradise. Like I need you to call sword. I need you to call sword and I'm like what? Like what are you? What are you talking about? She's like I just need you to call sword. They're gonna be able to explain this way better than I am, so here's the name of the person at sword. Give them a call, let me know what you find out. I was like cool, cool.
Speaker 2:I was fun to call sword.
Speaker 3:Yeah, so I had never, at any point in time, been in contact with sort of I. I don't know how many victims are in Contact with sort of, or how many survivors, because, again, language is important, right, steve, very much his victim, but I am a survivor, right? So, basically, I call them, I'm put through a very nice lady and To this moment, I'm pretty sure there are two ladies that, like, run that whole office and do all the interface between the public and the board itself, the sex offender registry board of individuals that classify these, these people, um, and I Don't know if my advocate had given her a heads up that I was gonna call him, assuming she did. I give her my name and she begins to go through some things. So, and there was a lot to take in. So the first, the first thing that she said to me was that this gentleman had been reclassified and I still just, I can't. This makes no sense to me because, um, number one, I should have been notified that he was even Requesting to be reclassified. Number two.
Speaker 3:I did not know it was possible to request reclassification. I Was told you get levels at the level that you're at and that is it. It's a lifetime registration. Come to find out it's not even a lifetime registration Once you have been classed, once your case has Served its course, once you're off probation because that's what that means. Okay, um, I, you have the right after I believe the first time may be longer, but it's every three years to request reclassification.
Speaker 3:Now, your victim does have the right to be notified of that request, much like your victim has the right to be notified when you request parole. Just to go back a little bit, those are two different notification systems that you, as the survivor, have to enroll in. Now, I had enrolled in both. However, at the time of my offenders parole hearing, I was not notified, and I found out that, for whatever reason, at the time of the conviction, although my paperwork was submitted and you have to remember this is before the internet was the way it is, so you had to fill out actual paperwork and fax it. My advocate had submitted that paperwork at the time of conviction A few years later. At the time parole, I was not in the actual system, so they did not, and again you have to opt in.
Speaker 2:Okay, yeah, so it's not an automatic procedure, it's an opt in procedure.
Speaker 3:Exactly, I did not and come to find out. You have to update that every time. Your phone number changes every time you move. It's not just hey Lynn, he is the victim of this offender. In this case, she opted to be notified. Let us hit up her registry records and figure out where she lives, hunt her down until we find her. It's no, let us call the last known number and hit up the last known address. That is it. So not only was I not in that system, but who knows, you know, if I would have had the same information? I don't remember if it changed in that first three years. Who knows if they would have been able to get me? But that's another story. I wasn't in the system.
Speaker 3:So, at that point. You know it was, it was a moot point Because he was being, he was being paroled, so that DOC system where I needed to be notified.
Speaker 3:The Byword of Corrections Was was now yes, sorry, was now irrelevant. Sorb, the sex offender registry board was the one that now mattered so that I could track his movements If I wanted to avoid the town he lived in, for example, or the place he worked, or places he worked so that the public knows when they go to the area he lives in. You know how many level twos in this particular case, because you can only get certain information on certain offenders so that the public knows that he's there.
Speaker 2:So I can give you a quick. I'm just going to give quick information for Massachusetts. This is pertaining to Massachusetts only. Level three you get a picture in the name. Level two you just have that. They're. They're in the area. And level one is not even reported anywhere. You'd have to request it in order to get it Please go ahead.
Speaker 3:Yes, yes, and this is such a nuanced situation, like the law is so complicated that it would take us forever to be super clear. So, in any way that we're unclear, please do the research like for real. Do the research because it's it's a lot different than the general public really realizes, even a survivor like myself who really thought she knew the system right, like you were protected, right?
Speaker 2:Oh yeah.
Speaker 3:And it thought and my, my advocate is super good at what she does moved very far up the chain at this point really good at what she does, I know I can trust her explain things very thoroughly. Still didn't. Still didn't play out. So anyway, sex offender registry board is supposed to notify me at this point. It's a separate notification system which I definitely made sure I was a part of at the time that I found out he was getting paroled and I wasn't in that system. New system got to make sure I'm in it, right.
Speaker 3:I don't know what happened. I can't remember in this moment if I was also kicked out of that like never got added to that or if my information had simply changed. And again, that's a thing I didn't realize I needed to update. When you change your phone number, when you move, you don't go I need to notify if the dude's in jail these two or three if you're my sister, because ice is a third one Okay, right, people that I moved, just in case something happens with my rapist. You're trying to put that stuff out of your, out of your head, right?
Speaker 2:So when he got, the importance of the Commonwealth of Massachusetts is to get your taxes that they know your name, phone number, address, shoe size, the whole nine yards Never had a problem hunting me down, just saying when you're a survivor, oh well, it's your responsibility. We won't even look within our system, and that's terrible, terrible, terrible work.
Speaker 3:Yes, and you know, they argue, they argue, and this is something I'd really like to change, and this is procedural. It would seem it's not. I don't even think it would require a statute change of any variety, but something I'd like to change is maybe we have an opt in system, since we already have an opt in system, to tie the, the notification systems, all of them.
Speaker 2:You think the board of probation, the board of parole and the DOC should all communicate effectively, that's they should be tied in in some way to like, let's say, your registry records.
Speaker 3:As a, as a survivor, I might opt in to have that tied at the very minimum if not to each other, because we know that's a problem right To my registry records so that when I move, when I change my phone number which happens all the time right, you don't have to, it follows you. That's, that's what I hope I have.
Speaker 2:We'd swear that you're going to ask for the Department of Children and Family to also be involved in this and know these things. Stop asking for the impossible.
Speaker 3:I know, you know, it's just a hat of mine.
Speaker 2:Protecting our survivors, that's not so important, but anyway I we laugh about it and it's dark humor for those who might see, hear her laugh or me smile.
Speaker 3:Yeah.
Speaker 2:The reality is, we need to laugh and smile through this dark stuff because it is terrible.
Speaker 3:Yeah, and if you don't laugh at it, you'll never be able to to get the gumption to do anything about it, because, you know, evil only flourishes when good men do nothing. And I'm sorry, but I'll be damned if I'm not going to use the pain that I've experienced and the and the trauma my sister experienced to to you know, do something good for others. Like you know, leave the world a little bit better than you found it. So, I can do with this.
Speaker 2:So let's go back to SORB.
Speaker 3:We you know SORB tells me, yeah, they say, look, we're sorry you weren't. We've already looked into this because we know you're going to ask questions, lynn. But and they are always so hesitant to tell you these things because they're going to get all that nine times out of 10. Like this stuff is incredibly re traumatizing and it's triggering. And so you're like what the fuck? And you're not even mad at the person because they're so nice, but you're just like distraught at the fact that this is possible.
Speaker 3:So I luckily had a lot of experience with that the first time around and I was ready for it. So I'm like just hit me with it Like it's good, you can talk, like you're good. And she's like, oh, thank God, like seriously, because this is not fun. I was like okay, yeah, no, hit me with it. He's like you know, not only were you not in the system or we didn't have your proper information, but he was re-leveled and he is now a level one sex offender, which again is terrifying, because you cannot get any information on a level one sex offender Like it's, it's crazy, like you can, but you have to be special. You know what I mean. The public isn't going to find out that.
Speaker 2:You know, joe Schmoe is a level one sex offender and let's get a Corey report on that person, a Corey report our bureau probation review that only usually only police officers and higher ups in different organizations can have access to. This is not public information and it's not available.
Speaker 3:Now for, for comparison, a level two, which is what he had been up to this point, and this is the better part of 15 years. Up to this point, right From his time of conviction, his picture and his name are not posted in the local police department. However, if you gave his name to the local police department, from what I understand, if you were to, you know, look up the level twos in your area and then request a detailed list. You can get that information.
Speaker 1:They also have to register.
Speaker 3:They also do have to register with where they live, with where they work. So, again, you're going to know, if you go to this business or this area, that there's a level two sex offender and you can get that person's name or these people's names if you look, and that's where he was at. So the public was ostensibly a whole lot more protected with this offender at a level two because again, it's based on the risk of reoffence than they were with this person as a level one. So then this, this very nice lady at SOAR, goes on to explain to me that, as far as the leveling is concerned, leveling laws have changed. And the reason that she is explaining this to me is because, in the course of conversation and I believe that this was over multiple conversations, like how all of this information that I'm going to end up snowballing into one piece came out she goes on to tell me that my sister's offender is going to be leveled level two as well. Okay, that his determination just came out.
Speaker 3:Now this is a man. This is a man, steve, that sodomized a 12 year old at knife point held, held her hostage over a period of hours with his 16 year old accomplice, so also arguably raked. This was a 26 year old, arguably it is and yeah, drug dealing gang member.
Speaker 3:In the eyes of the state it's not rape of a child, though, because she was 16. And that's how disgusting some of our laws are. But anyway, that's why I say arguably, just to be clear, because I believe it is rape. Basically, this man is now he then ran right, gone caught by America's most wanted, not even out of jail yet. He's going to be labeled a level two and at the time of his conviction he was found to have been being investigated for raping several other 12 year olds in New York, where he had originally come from.
Speaker 3:She therefore felt the need to go on to explain to me that the way that the sex offender registry board makes these decisions has changed, and changed significantly, which impacted my case, impacted my offenders, re leveling and may well be why he requested to be re leveled when he did, because it changed right before he requested re leveling.
Speaker 3:The burden of proof now rests on the state of Massachusetts to prove that somebody is a risk of re offense, and that is significant because prior to this ruling by the, by the Superior Court of Massachusetts, it was on the offender to prove that they are no longer a risk of re offending.
Speaker 3:In addition, the burden of proof has increased from most likely like a civil case, right Like it's most likely a thing that this guy is a high risk of re offense to a similar standard as a criminal trial, which is beyond a reasonable doubt. So essentially it takes multiple convictions at the bare minimum in practice and I know this was not the intention of the court when they did this Okay, so in practice it takes multiple convictions minimum, multiple accusations documented to become a level three sex offender. So in practice, let's just be very clear A gang member, a drug dealer who was also in this country illegally, who sodomizes a 12 year old with his 16 year old accomplice at Knife Point and then runs from the courthouse and is on the land for two years, apprehended by America's most wanted, is a level two because it was only one, 12 year old.
Speaker 2:Yep, you know, lynn, you gave us a lot that. I know there's other stuff here, yeah, but you gave us a lot of talk about and this and really I want my audience to really process that and I know it's gonna seem abrupt to some of you, but I think that we hit the main points that we want to talk about. The legal system I don't want to let you go Without you talking to me about, Because of your experience, because of everything that's gone on Mm-hmm, you're creating a nonprofit. Tell me more about that.
Speaker 3:Yes, and we're creating the nonprofit for so many different reasons, but the number one thing that we're creating the nonprofit to do is Fill the gaps that allowed my sister to fall through the cracks, and by that I mean provide access, adequate access to addicts, all right with trauma history, and it doesn't have to be a sexual abuse Trauma history. There is all sorts of trauma and I think if you, if you delve into the recovery sphere and talk to any Addict, you'll find that most of us have some sort of significant trauma, whether prior to our addiction. We may not even realize it's what led to or drives our addiction, but either prior to or definitely Through our addiction, which can oftentimes, if over a period of years, keep you out, if it's not the thing that got you out in the first place, and out meaning using so. So for my sister right, she had the executive dysfunction, the inability to Do certain things that might seem simple, like a source and set up treatment and the healthcare system the way it is in this country I'm not gonna go political here but it's very difficult to navigate.
Speaker 3:It's especially difficult to navigate when it comes to substance abuse. It's especially especially difficult to navigate when it comes to trauma-informed care. It's especially, especially, especially like uber difficult to navigate, damn near impossible to navigate, when it comes to trauma-informed care for addicts at the level of, like you know, stabilization and and every single Level after that. So, like even getting clean with a dual diagnosis meaning both mental health and Substance abuse issues that gives you some semblance of trauma-informed care, meaning they even know what the symptoms of trauma are and how that's gonna impact you as you're trying to get clean right Is damn near impossible. And so when you add to that that you are suffering from all of that.
Speaker 3:Actively to the mix, you're, you're gonna have a real hard time getting that treatment. So that was my sister's thing. So what? I and my family because it's a group effort as well as a close friend of mine who is also a survivor, another friend of mine that I've met through just kind of exploring what there is to be done about this process, about this situation. Right is is create a specialty case management service for addicts In recovery, because when you're getting into the actual trauma treatment which is what my sister needed you should be ideally stabilized, so not actively using.
Speaker 2:And then certainly not within the first three to six months.
Speaker 3:Yes, yes, and that funny. You should say that that makes me feel better, because I'm thinking that looks like about three to six months in, right, steve, I can give you the.
Speaker 2:I can give you the logic. So when you use it takes Relatively six months for your brain to refunction properly. So when you start off I always tell people you can go and recovery all you want, but you're really in sobriety because your brain is still all screwed up, because all the fun like the Executive function is not communicating effectively. It's looking for rapid dopamine, rapid response, which is what the substances typically are. So I wanted to share that with you because when people tell me like I've had too many people come in they're loved ones and they say you didn't do anything with them for a couple of months, I'm like be patient, take six months. I'm not even worrying about trauma, I'm not even worrying about Depression, because it's not even depression they're showing. They're showing symptomology of coming off Substances. Yeah, don't, don't put a label. Yet I'm not putting in zero labels and if you're not happy about it I don't give a crap and that again is part of the trauma response, the trauma informed and and substance abuse informed people who have not worked in substance use.
Speaker 2:They go like oh, they seem depressed, yeah, they're not drinking anymore.
Speaker 1:Oh hey, I'm depressed. Yeah.
Speaker 2:And that's what I tell them. Or they're anxious. Yeah, they used to have opioids and that would calm them down automatically. Nothing's calming them down. They're like on their hair, triggered at that point.
Speaker 2:You cannot have an anxiety disorder at that point, or bipolar because they have mood swings, because, again, the brain is trying to stabilize. Anyway, I wanted to inform people about the substance abuse and the trauma. And yeah, I'm here because I see it too many times. People come in like you know, they diagnosed me with bipolar when I was coming off Whatever, and I'm like no, you're not bipolar, you're probably just fucked up from your brain, not functioning properly for months. But anyway, just wanted to throw that out.
Speaker 3:The name of the, the nonprofit, is so we're gonna call it and this is tentative because we're in the process of setting it up we're gonna call it AJ's way. So, as in Amanda, jean, right, as my dad called her, aj, aj's way, as in a way out, and again for my sister, what that would have looked like. And she actually succeeded for like the only time that I can confirm in her adult life, in Recovery for a couple of years, around the time she got pregnant with and had and was raising in the early years my youngest niece, through drug court, and drug court set up her treatment. Much the same way I'm Envisioning, or we're envisioning, that will set up services for these people. They, they gave her a Plan. They didn't just say, hey, you need to go get help. You maybe find a therapist and a psychiatrist. You know, maybe, like I don't know, go out in nature and take a walk, like because that's the standard, that's like what these places do, like they'll just give you a list and say, hey, go get some help, right, drug court actually set it up for her. Hey, this is your therapist. You're seeing her on Tuesdays once a month. You see your psychiatrist on Thursday at 3 pm. You're required to go to these groups. You're required to hit this many meetings. Here are some people in the local recovery community that you can speak with. If you want to get in with them, you know we'd suggest you do some alternative therapies and they they would help her set that up. So the way I envision it and again, the whole first piece of this is gonna be doing the research it's gonna require a lot of time and effort to do the research.
Speaker 3:I'm not a professional by any means. I have lived experience, you know, and you know I'm networking with people like yourself. That's the whole first piece of this To develop a resource like a database right of trauma-informed care providers. I'm talking everybody from the stuff that you need to get your health insurance going and to get actually stable in housing. That's something that happens right off the rip when you're, when you're getting clean. Oftentimes you need those things financial assistance and things like that. Right, that's not our primary focus, but you got to be stable to get the trauma treatment you need. To your average, you know therapists, but like your average psychiatrist, your average groups, like I just said. But then, more importantly, the very trauma specific modalities of therapy that Exists now, that are being discovered and backed up every single day, so that might look like rapid eye movement, emdr, right. For those of you that don't know what that is, I'm not gonna go into it. Please look it up. It's, it's very Episode.
Speaker 2:I think every episode I've ever done is there's a mention of it.
Speaker 3:Yeah, I wouldn't be able to effectively explain it. Please just do yourself the service of looking it up if you have trauma and you want different modalities. My father, he's a vet with some trauma. He realized he needed to get some more help than just the talk therapy was giving him. He did some EMDR sessions. It changed his life. The my sister was never stable enough to go there. She tried, but she wasn't stable enough to go there. Then there's all sorts of somatic therapies like just that. Look into alternative therapies, trauma-informed treatment Because, again, we are so quick to go talk therapy, medication meetings For me, I would not be in the place that I'm at today and I am going through some shit, steve, because that is not even.
Speaker 3:Once again, that is not even the tip of the iceberg. I had to fight. Turns out there was no stay-away order because it expires with the probation. I had to fight for a harassment order that I originally you know one but lost because they didn't extend it. They were like we're not sure if we can give you this or not it like you know what I mean.
Speaker 2:I want to know how we can reach you to put yourselves and help you out and be Part of this. What would would to be the best way to reach you?
Speaker 3:You know it would. It would be most likely to email me. You know I would take phone calls at this point. I need all the help I can get getting this up and running, doing the research I need to do. I would welcome anyone that wants to discuss, like the current state of the system when it comes to this end of things. You know, because having to fight your rapist in court for a harassment order, having to pay a lawyer To to do that, is incredibly Retraumatizing. This gentleman was actually charged in this particular case because the church did not know that he was a sex offender, even though they had SOP to prevent that. He did not register as having worked at that church. Like these are all things I'd love to get out there so we can change that. The nonprofit itself is gonna have a website. It's AJ's wayorg, a J s, as in Sam WA Yorg. That will be up and running very, very soon.
Speaker 2:So, lynn, I'm gonna put in your email address in Mike show notes I'm gonna put the AJ's way org Mm-hmm in them and I just want to thank you again for sharing your story. I can't thank you enough. Please reach out to Lynn. This is an amazing project that she's starting. That is very much needed. Recovery courts I've started to in Massachusetts myself. I participate in about five of them. It's the best case management you'll ever have and being able to bring that outside of a court system is Essential and I want to thank you for doing that, and thank you again for the interview.
Speaker 3:Thanks, steve, I I truly appreciate the time.
Speaker 2:Well, that concludes episode 120 of finding your way through therapy. Thank you so much, lynn key. I think that you need to all pay attention to these legal ramification and what happens in the long term after all this occurs, and in a very progressive state like Massachusetts. Imagine what happens in other states. I'm not very familiar, but I'm assuming there could be other issues somewhere else, but episode 121 will be with a new guest that I've never had before, but someone I've been watching on TikTok and Really enjoy her content. Her name is Jenny Helms Calvin and she's gonna be on Episode 121, and I hope you join me then.
Speaker 1:Please like, subscribe and follow this podcast on your favorite platform. A glowing review is always helpful and, as a reminder, this podcast is for informational, educational and entertainment purposes only. If you're struggling with a mental health or substance abuse issue, please reach out to a professional counselor for consultation. If you are in a mental health crisis, call 988 for assistance. This number is available in the United States.
